'No Spanking' Law Fails

[bloodrayne]

To Spank Or Not To Spank?

California - Assemblywoman Sally Lieber (Democrat for Mountain View) has proposed a law that would prohibit parental spanking of children younger than 4.

Her proposal would make spanking a child 3 and younger a crime punishable by up to a year in jail and a fine of $1,000.

The 45 year old lawmaker is single and has no children but as a cat owner has said “My vet told me to never hit my cat, and if that is true for cats then no parent should ever hit a child.” "I think it's pretty hard to argue that you need to beat a child 3 years old or younger."

It has stirred a nationwide conversation not only about child discipline but also the role of government in directing parental behavior.

It has provoked a deep reaction from people, most of whom are not in favor of the law and who have been very critical of Assemblywoman Lieber for raising it.

Her suggestion has been called “unreal”, absurd”, “idiotic”, “ravings of an ignorant spinster”. Her response has been “I’d rather be called a few names than know there are children out there being beaten who are defenseless.”

It is more than ironic that a politician who wants to make it illegal for parents to apply their flat hands to their babies' bare bottoms is more than happy to allow the heavy hand of the law to yank parents from their homes and place them behind bars for disciplining their own children in the way that they see fit and does not injure a child.

"I think we ought to have a law against beating children," Lieber told The San Francisco Chronicle last week.

That's the problem. California does have laws against beating children. But in this politically correct atmosphere, do-gooders believe it is their right to pass laws that expand definitions beyond reason so that a spanking is a beating -- when it isn't.

In effect, this is what Lieber really is saying in proposing such a law: I know how to raise your kids, and I am going to make it illegal for other parents to discipline their children in a way I do not like. If you don't do it my way, you can go to jail.

As Lieber sees it, spanking is "not effective," as children under 4 "don't understand it." And: Spanking trains children "in violence and domination, even when it's moderate."

While Lieber may believe that she is trying to protect children, it's hard to see how a big fine or putting mom or dad in jail for a spanking could be even remotely in a toddler's interest.

Joseph D. McNamara, a retired police chief of San Jose, Calif., and now a research fellow at Stanford's Hoover Institution, told me that if he were a beat cop, he would be "horrified" at the prospect of enforcing a spanking ban.

Such a law would put police in "everyone's living rooms," where they would have to regulate parenting. Or as Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger so aptly put it when first told about the proposed law, "How do you enforce that?"

McNamara told me he could conceive of instances in which good parents might choose to do so. Say a parent repeatedly tells a young child not to run into the street, or not to talk to strangers, or to stop hurting a younger sibling -- and words alone have not worked.

In such cases, parents -- not a Sacramento lawmaker -- know what best to do. And while Lieber told me she wants to draw a line that makes physical discipline a "black and white" issue, California parents have been dealing with shades of gray since before Lieber was in diapers.

Parents are not stupid, they know the difference between beating and spanking, and they do not need her to draw the line for them.

What's next -- McNamara wondered -- a law against grabbing your kid by the arm? Pass such laws, he added, and you'll see a state in which "parents are afraid to discipline the child." As if that would be good for California families.

Lieber's response is that wife-beating once was off-limits to law enforcement, but in this enlightened age, the law does come between a man's fist and his wife's face. Again, she fails to distinguish between beating and spanking.

Lieber explained: "Things have changed. Now we tell parents what to do and what not to do."The state makes adults use car seats for children, and there are laws to keep them away from lead-based paint.

Except spanking doesn't cause physical harm, as car accidents and lead paint can. And if spanking does injure children, it is illegal. This is more about philosophy than safety -- and California lawmakers don't have a right to mandate how parents think about raising their own kids. Those who want the government to stay out of the bedroom should not want it in the nursery or at the kitchen table, either.


Spanking Law Expands to Cover Teens

Assemblywoman Sally Lieber, D-Mountain View, says her bill will now include physical punishment of all minors, or children under 18 years old.

Even though the measure isn't even a bill yet, the idea has gotten nationwide attention, including Saturday Night Live's segment of Weekend Update.

The Legislative Counsel is expected to finish writing the official language of the legislation today and the bill will be unveiled tomorrow, Lieber said.

The lawmaker's original idea was to ban spanking of a child 3 years old and younger and make it punishable by up to a year in jail and $1,000 fine. The latest version will include shaking of an infant or toddler, she said.

The bill will also ''clarify" the existing law against child abuse by defining certain actions as illegal, Lieber said. The legislator didn't want to divulge the details just yet, but did say under her bill, using an ''implement" against a minor would also be illegal.


The Final Outcome:

The infamous spanking bill that would ban parents from inflicting corporal punishment on their children has been shot down. Assemblywoman Sally Lieber (D-Mountain View) stripped the anti-spanking portion of the bill because opposition to the provision meant it had small chance of passing.

[Roderick Usher]

This was a big deal out here in Cali. Thank god it failed, the last thing we need is the government nannying.

[_____V_____]

This was outrageous...and outlandish. The last thing we needed in Cali.

[Roderick Usher]

Originally Posted by _____V_____

This was outrageous...and outlandish. The last thing we needed in Cali.

If Paris Hilton had been spanked (as a child of course) she might have learned a touch of respect.

[Freak]

I don't think there is anything wrong with spanking your child.Some People do take it to the extreme's sometime's but for the most part they don't.I got plenty of spanking's when I was child and as I got older I got the belt a few time's.And none of those time's would I've ever calld it abuse.It's discipline, and thing's would be a lot better today if more parent's took some responsibilty and disciplined there kid's and stop pointing finger's.

[Vodstok]

WHy do people always equate spanking with beating? A light slap on the ass is spanking, beating leaves bruises and cuts, and is often closed-fisted.


I might spank my kid, but I would NEVER beat her.

[Dante'sInferno]

We need to spank our Children!Otherwise we could have another Paris Hilton!If we didnt't this is what would happend.










The world would emplode on it's self.It couldn't handle that much stupidity.

[Vodstok]

Originally Posted by Dante'sInferno

The world would emplode on it's self.It couldn't handle that much stupidity.

Kids, can you spell "Irony"? :p

[azathoth777]

“My vet told me to never hit my cat, and if that is true for cats then no parent should ever hit a child.”
That will be a favorite quote for awhile. What does she think you should do, spray water in a kids face when they're bad.
I hope this lady never does have children.....