Gun Control Debate

[PR3SSUR3]

I quote from New Yorkers Against Gun Violence:-

'WHERE DO ILLEGAL GUNS COME FROM?

Virtually every illegally possessed firearm recovered in New York State began its life as a legal product, manufactured or imported by a company licensed by the federal government and sold by a licensed dealer. The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (BATF) has determined that there are multiple streams carrying guns downstream into the illegal market: corrupt sales by licensed dealers and distributors, straw purchases by individuals or rings, unregulated, multiple or unlimited sales in states with weak gun laws, sales at gunshows, private sales, and theft.

GUNS FLOW SWIFTLY FROM THE LEGAL TO THE ILLEGAL MARKET

The flow of firearms downstream into the illegal market is rapid. 70% of guns entering the stream of illegal trafficking are new. 30-40% of all crime guns traced by the federal government pass in less than three years from a legitimate sale by a licensed dealer into the wrong hands at a crime scene. Illegal weapons pour even more swiftly into the hands of youth: the BATF estimated that as many as 54% of the illegal firearms recovered in connection with persons ages 18-24 were sold by a federal firearms licensee less than three years before.'

Conclusion: illegal guns are primariy, and rapidly, sourced from legal sales. Therefore stopping legal sales will indeed stem the flow of illegal weapons. Those already circulating the underground will be offered an amnesty, then continuing policing and a cleanup operation will gradually reduce what firearms remain.

Drugs: if they were all legal, you would find a lot more junkies about - good for society?

Again, it takes more effort to use a blade or bar against an individual than to pull a trigger - and the results are less likely to be fatal.

The armed 'safety' of the American family is borne from fear, which is generated from the right to bear arms. Really, Americans haven't stopped shooting since they were first made.

[AmericanManiac]

I just heard on the radio, school all across the country are getting bomb threats now. Guess what marks this friday ? The ann. of Columbine, and they were trying to decide to cancel classes or not.

[meetthecreeper]

First try and think logically and not emotionally.


Here is the problem with America coming from an american. We as a society have fostered a public of narcissism and cowardace. Everyone is concerned about one thing themselves and noone else. This is what fosters situations like this Cho wacko.

The other thing is we are a nation of cowards. Someone comes in with a gun and we cower in the corner like sheep in a burning barn while the damn barn door is wide open waiting for the farmer to come and save us all.

Sorry brothers and sisters it isnt going to happen. Not one of those people with the exception of courageous professor tried to stop this clown. They were all too concerned with their own safety and too scared to do anything to try and stop it.

I guess 9/11 didnt teach us anything. In any situation FIGHT BACK. Our survival as a society depends on it.

I am not ready to die as much as the next person but if the situation arises I am not going to sit there and just take it. Someone comes to kill me, family or friends they have got a fight coming. SHit I teach my 6 and 8 year olds that. Its sad that this is the way the world is but its something we all have to face.

About guns. No amount of banning is going to stop what happened. Cho was determined to kill and the students at VT were denied the right to have the tools to defend themselves. I am not saying firearm ownership is for everyone its not. In fact I think iif you want a firearm then you need to have a mentor to guide you in the proper use and safety of a firearm.

Law enforcement is there to solve the crime after the fact. They dont have the time or resources to protect everyone. Nor do they have an obligation to do so.

Everyone has an obligation for thier own personal responsibility and safety.

[PR3SSUR3]

Well banning guns now cannot fix crimes in the past, nor some that are destined to happen in the future - but it will gradually reduce the availability of weapons to people like Cho.

I was wondering myself how he managed to kill 32 people on his own - surely somebody must have tried to seize him and grab his weapon(s)? I fucking would - if he came near he'd better not miss because he wouldn't get a second chance.

Surely with a campus the size of Virginia Tech, there should be allowances for a small amount of 'on site' arms in the wake of these college shooting trends? These could remain under the control of qualified security/police operating on the campus, even after a public firearms ban.

[Despare]

Originally Posted by PR3SSUR3

if he came near he'd better not miss because he wouldn't get a second chance

From what I've read he didn't... almost everybody shot (including the survivors were shot three times). You're right though, how did he do all that, find time to mail his video and crap, and then go back to shooting!? I blame rap music.

[PR3SSUR3]

NBC should not have shown any of his video either, allowing him the final word even from beyond the grave. But principals won't get in the way of commerce and a good scoop.

He also mentioned Columbine, and perhaps the gun debate should steer round to media coverage which is a clear factor in further 'copycat' incidents.

[bwind22]

He shot 2 people in the dorms, then went back to his room & got the package & went to the post office. Then he returned to campus & went into the classroom building & proceded firing. I don't know how much everyone knows about guns, but one of the guns he used was a Glock which can be reloaded in literally just a couple seconds. The shooting would have been nearly nonstop so it's not like there would have been any "good" time for someone to try to stop him. Doing so would have almost surely resulted in getting shot.

[Despare]

Originally Posted by bwind22

He shot 2 people in the dorms, then went back to his room & got the package & went to the post office. Then he returned to campus & went into the classroom building & proceded firing. I don't know how much everyone knows about guns, but one of the guns he used was a Glock which can be reloaded in literally just a couple seconds. The shooting would have been nearly nonstop so it's not like there would have been any "good" time for someone to try to stop him. Doing so would have almost surely resulted in getting shot.

If he was rushed by five or six people from every direction then he would have been stopped. I personally would have thought, "I'll probably get shot anyway so I may as well try and charge him...".

[bwind22]

Originally Posted by Despare

If he was rushed by five or six people from every direction then he would have been stopped. I personally would have thought, "I'll probably get shot anyway so I may as well try and charge him...".

Yeah, well that's the sorta thing that is much easier said than done. I'm sure anyone in that situation is just reacting on adrenaline & instinct.

[PR3SSUR3]

Unless he had an electric forcefield around him, I don't see how some brave souls couldn't have attacked him and pinned him down.

But apparently the gun being seen as the harbringer of death on this day has resulted in only blind panic or pleads of mercy.