Abortion - actual thread

[Nate]

Originally posted by Sam The Egg
All I'm doing is looking at what has been factually proven (What classifies a living being as a mammal, stages of development of the fetus), and basing my opinion off of that. There is fact backing me, and I've brought it up. You haven't. If you can't, don't bother. If you can, do it.
You brought up a soul, that is religious. Say you aren't religious all you want, I don't care. You brought something religious into it.

I just showed you proof that they cant proove anything what more do you want?If there is fact backing you then it wouldnt be an opinion now would it?I dont even think you know what to believe your mixing fact and opinion and those 2 dont go together.I showed you that nothing can be proved now you show me where any group of scientists will tell me exactly when a fetus should be considered a life ,then ill state what you are saying as a fact, but the problem is you will never find anything like that because it doesnt exsist.You will never hear a scientists tell you the exact day a life starts because they dont even know.

[Vodstok]

Originally posted by VampRocker
Well, if you were raised to think murder was alright, don't you think you'd be mad at the government for outlawing it? You'd be pissed.

If you think abortion is murder, you'd be horrified to think that the government would allow a go-ahead on it.

If abortion is legal, I only find it fair that manslaughter (towards humans out of the womb) be legal, too.

I just wanna play fair.

Wonderful, why dont you go break eric rudolph out of jail. Apparently, life isnt important once it is born, just when it is gestating. I swear, i have never seen as much disregad for people who have already been BORN than i have in pro-lifers.... Who the fuck are you to choose who lives and who dies once they have been born? are you no longer innocent?

[Sam The Egg]

Originally posted by Nate
I just showed you proof that they cant proove anything what more do you want?If there is fact backing you then it wouldnt be an opinion now would it?I dont even think you know what to believe your mixing fact and opinion and those 2 dont go together.I showed you that nothing can be proved now you show me where any group of scientists will tell me exactly when a fetus should be considered a life ,then ill state what you are saying as a fact, but the problem is you will never find anything like that because it doesnt exsist.You will never hear a scientists tell you the exact day a life starts because they dont even know.

You've shown me 'proof' that nothing can be prooven. I want the facts that you're basing your opinion on that abortion should be illegal. I said before, my opinion is based on the following:
Fact: Two of the things that classify a life form as a mammal are a spinal chord and the ability to breath with lungs.
Fact: Humans are mammals
Fact: The backbone is in place in 6 weeks, the lungs in 8 weeks. That's 2 months.
All of that is undisputed fact. There is nothing saying that they have a soul, and the soul is a religious concept. Thus, you cannot bring souls into it. So don't. I don't care whether you're religious our not, do not bring up souls.
No. Ovums and sperm aren't people. They could potentially BECOME people. They aren't people.

I say again, if you have no fact, do not bother to reply.

[GorePhobia]

i think if its been less then 2 months then abortion is okay...because it isnt living fully yet....so that my opinon

[Nate]

3 weeks from conception when the embryo is about 2 mm long and has started to develop visible external body parts

4 weeks when its heart starts to beat.

4 weeks and you have a heartbeat hmm if thats not a life i dunno what is. 6 weeks from conception, when brain waves can be first sensed

This is all within a 6 week period and i dunno about you but brain waves and a heartbeat is life enough for me

[Sam The Egg]

Are you even listening? Are you reading the posts? I'm trying not to just completely rip into you, but you're making that really difficult. I'm not arguing whether or not it's alive. I'm not. It's alive or it's not, whatever. I'm arguing whether or not it's human.

Also, you didn't post a link to where you found all your proof from.

[Nate]

Originally posted by Sam The Egg
Are you even listening? Are you reading the posts? I'm trying not to just completely rip into you, but you're making that really difficult. I'm not arguing whether or not it's alive. I'm not. It's alive or it's not, whatever. I'm arguing whether or not it's human.

Also, you didn't post a link to where you found all your proof from.

ok so you feel like something has to be defined as a human to decide whether or not it is right to abort it or not.I will only answer like this.
1.Are the limbs that show after 3 weeks human?? yes
2.Is the heart that beats after 4 weeks human?? yes
3.is the brain that starts to form after 6 weeks human??yes

And this is all in the first trimenster when its still legal to abort.not only that theres DNA to prove its human shortley after conception.I see what your getting at and you have your beliefs and i respect that but this really is getting us knowwhere.

[Rotting Eye]

All I can say is, if you're battling with Sam and I, you're wrong.

I suggest no one post again until someone has facts, or can at least attempt to argue their point with civility and without religion. He's mentioned numerous times that all we want to see factual evidence.

He's brought some up to the table, why can't anyone else? Or is it because no one else can find anything to support their side of the argument? People have been relying too heavily on name-calling, religion, and ignorance to express their point. I'm beginning to feel embarrassed for them.

[GorePhobia]

hey Im with you and sam....soo i can post right?

[Sam The Egg]

Originally posted by Nate
ok so you feel like something has to be defined as a human to decide whether or not it is right to abort it or not.I will only answer like this.
1.Are the limbs that show after 3 weeks human?? yes
2.Is the heart that beats after 4 weeks human?? yes
3.is the brain that starts to form after 6 weeks human??yes

And this is all in the first trimenster when its still legal to abort.not only that theres DNA to prove its human shortley after conception.I see what your getting at and you have your beliefs and i respect that but this really is getting us knowwhere.

The fetus gets it's own DNA one second after conception. I know, I posted a link to a site that lists all the stages of birth. Thing is, I have no sympathy for DNA. A lot of things have limbs and a heart and a brain.

Points for trying to bring facts, but there's no support.