Any REAL punk band is "Indie". And Emo heritege ? Minor threat ? Was that a joke ?

"Crass had a lot of relevant beliefs. So taking a stand on Racism, Sexism and exploitation of your fellow humans is stupid and unrealistic?"

I can name a lot of other punk bands that stand for the SAME thing, including fugazi but you dismiss them for being either sell outs or too mainstream (The Clash and Sex Pistols). also, The Clash kills the Crass. Not only musicial but lyrically. The message is more important then staying "TRUE". Whatever the fuck that means. The Crass was just a bunch of drunks. While the Clash was serious about making music for the people.

I said "unrealistic", I meant "anarchy". You took my whole comment out of context and acted like I was against EVERYTHING they stand for :rolleyes:

Its hypocritical posting "Punk is dead" and then posting "New" punk bands that are good. Because "punk is dead" right ?

I HATE the word "Punk". So if you think fugazi isn't "Punk" thats not a insult at all. Even if they did come from the hardcore scene, and played more protest and charity shows then all of the bands you name. Put together. :rolleyes:

That "Army" you speak of. Is just copying mostly failed generation. That only took fashion from the music and not the message. Punk is a flawed system.

I was refering to Indie Rock the genre (more extreme edgedor quirky alternative music) not their label status. Ian Mackaye's band Embrace and Guy Piccoloto's Rites Of Spring were the pioneers of Emo. I didn't say Minor Threat were Emo I said they were punk. ------>Punk/Emo Heritege<-------

Crass weren't drunks. I posted "Punk is Dead" because of the thread title it's pretty obvious I don't think so. Crass were a better band than the Clash ever was and they had a hell of a lot more to say. And yeh The Clash were fucking sellouts. The Sex Pistols against sexism?! I 'spose GG Allin was a woman's right advocate too.

The new bands I mentioned isn't copying any of the past acts they're doing their own thing and are influenced more by grindcore and alternative music than anything else. As far as these guys "taking the fashion from the music and not the message" you must be kidding me?! These guys are just as active (if not more) at protest as Fugazi was. Aus-Rotten for example were a massive driving force behind events and protests.

...Man, your the first person in this forum(that I know of) that mentioned Flogging Molly...very cool...
They're a awsome band...:cool:

Emo is the worst insult you can give in the "Punk" culture. But Emo (the term and meaning) wasn't around until the late 90's. Emo is used for bands like sum41 and Blink 182. Embrace ? Rites Of Spring ? That is a big difference. Maybe they're not PUNK. but thats more "Indie" music then what you say fugazi is. And Fugazi is hardcore, they are the only band that survived from the scene and the only band that is still fighting.

If you wanna talk shit about my favorite band and the best hardcore/"Punk" band of all time. I gotta a million reason why they are better then any other band. Besides your from New Zealand, Punk came from America. Don't be throwing terms around that American band invented.

Plus, you missed the whole concept. I never was against ALL of beliefs of crass. Just Anarachy, which you still know is unrealistic.

The clash never preached like Crass. It was always about music then the message. Crass was about message then music. When people goto shows they don't want to be preached someone elses beliefs, if people are oppressed by the governments forced ideas. Do you think they wanna goto a club and get feed rebel idea's ? Music should be inspiring, not pure idealistic. But we are going to disagree about that one.

...How can you throw Sum41 and blink 182 in the same genre...
Sum41 is a heavy/rock band....now I know they made some songs to reach the public, but that's it....Listen to some of their songs (other than the shit on mtv)...It's fucking Rock, man! It has an Iron Maiden sound to it...right on....:cool:

Embrace and Rites Of Spring were Emocore bands. Blink 182 and Sum 41 are pop punk.

I wasn't giving Fugazi shit. There one of my all time favorite bands. I just don't include them in the punk category.

Why can't I use terminology coined in the states? :confused: So because I'm from New Zealand and don't come from the states I can't comment on the genre? Emo is a stupid term anyway and gets used WAY to loosely/often these days.

Can idealistic music not be inspiring? I myself find it innspiring and informative. Depends on what the individual is into I guess.
I wouldn't say Crass preached... but I can see how you'd see it that way they are pretty blunt and to the point in their songs.

..... I can't be fucked getting into a Anarchy debate. But yeh certain principles make sense and could work. But on a whole its not really feasible.

The Clash were more of a rock band anyway and would appeal to a wider audience. I don't class them as a punk band (something I'm sure you'll violentley disagree with me on).

... I know your talkin to someone else on this subject, but how can you classify sum41 as pop....I mean, shit I've seen 'em twice live and have some of their albums.....and beleive me, their not pop.....maybe all you ever heard from them is the shit they play on mtv or the radio...if that's the case, check out some of their other songs.......they really do ......Rock...:cool:

No they don't "Rock" and I hate them. If I could kick any bands ass, it would be Sum41. I hate they're spiky hair and their stupid wannabe poser clothing. I don't wanna be a jerk but if your going to add to our converstation, you gotta know more about music then just Sum41. Sorry man.

You make some point Elvis but terminology is a tricky topic. And it varies from person to person. Terms are just perception. So my comment was ignorant about "America". Hey, I can admit it.

I love the crass, I think they are amazing but idealistic music isn't always inspiring. Maybe too you & I, it is. But to the common person, it comes off as preachy and forced. Which is not always the way to get a message across. Thats also a reason why they ain't well known.

I will always be hung up on Fugazi, every time I put on a album it always amazes me how much talent everyone has.

You hate the word "Emo", I hate the word "punk. Because emo bands are called "punk" now a days and original punk bands are called emo.

Pennywise, Bad Religion, The Ramones, The Misfits, Flogging Molly, Sex Pistols, The Descendents, Black Flag, The Dickies, Me First And The Gimmie Gimmies, 88 Fingers Louie, The Exploited, The Bruisers, Circle Jerks.

For sure dude. I've been listening to them since I was 13. One of my favorite rhythm sections in music. I'm not as much of a fiend on them as I used to be but still love them. Have they actually parted ways now or what?